CBF1000

CBF1000 => Lighting, Electrical, and Wiring => Topic started by: vinciebhoy on 08 September, 2019, 10:45:32 PM

Title: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 08 September, 2019, 10:45:32 PM
Hi, I am now a member of the Burnt out Stator club and I am looking for an up to date list of the better suppliers of Stators.
I fitted a volt meter in march this year as I wanted an early warning of a stator failure.
On the way back from a 221 mile ride out on Saturday ( 5 miles from home) the Volt meter showed 12.1 volts and on testing today I have found that I need to replace the Stator.

 :028:
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Piper on 09 September, 2019, 08:25:29 AM
Loads of threads on this site for stators. Here for example

https://www.cbf1000.com/index.php?topic=18550.0

Good luck.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 09 September, 2019, 10:35:05 AM
When my stator failed after a very reasonable 11 years of excellent service I replaced it for a £95 (now £110) Electrosport direct fit stator from M&P. Link here https://www.mandp.co.uk/products/honda-cbf1000-06-12-generator-stator-electrosport-677550

That was 2 years ago, if it failed again now or, if there had been London stock 2 years ago, I'd have been tempted with what appears to be London stock of a Chinese direct fit stator at £41.79 delivered. Link here https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Magneto-Generator-Stator-Coil-For-Honda-CBF1000-sc58-2006-2011-GB/352724338867

Not doubting your charging system diagnosis and assuming you got less than the expected 14.8v at 5,000 RPM. However my goto friend when suspecting a charging system fault is Electrosportís generic fault finding flow chart for motorcycle charging systems, link here https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1091/5694/files/fault-finding-diagram.pdf?235929069374954073
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 09 September, 2019, 12:26:40 PM
Thanks for the quick reply's
The regulator tested OK, but when I done a resistance check on the stator I got 2.3 ohms between windings and the same when I test each to ground, on the attached photo you can see top right looks a tad too black!!
I will probably go for the electrosport stator.

Cheers

 :002:
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 09 September, 2019, 02:19:23 PM
Sounds as if you tested it all in a 'proper job' style. At 2.3 ohms across the windings the stator wouldn't have completely failed but will be in need of replacement since that failure is waiting to happen any time soon. No photo attached but certainly if you have blackened windings that's the writing on the wall. Sounds as if you got the warning just in time. I've always resisted the need for an onboard voltage meter, maybe I should re-consider. It would have to be an actual voltage readout rather than one of those traffic light gadgets that are forever flickering between green, amber and red without actually telling you what the voltage is.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 09 September, 2019, 06:05:30 PM
Yeh the 2.3 ohms is the total resistance of what each segment should be and the reading to earth shows that the burnt out segment is probably shorting to earth.

Picture on original post.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 09 September, 2019, 06:33:11 PM
That'll be back on the road in no time.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: catford lad on 11 September, 2019, 04:20:43 PM
I used a company called Electrex. They manufacture in house and also do a reg/rec. Good service.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: raYzerman on 11 September, 2019, 06:30:39 PM
I bought a spare stator from RM Stator, a reputable company here... the box is labelled Made In China.  If I were getting a spare again, I'd just get one from China much cheaper.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: VanquishedWombat on 11 September, 2019, 07:58:35 PM
I have a MkI and am pondering fitting a volt meter for same purpose as you. As I'm not sure I'll be able to remember the meanings of the traffic light variety I was wondering what meter you fitted and if you had a pic of it in situ, was it easy to fit, etc ?

VW.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 12 September, 2019, 03:20:08 AM
The Electrosport stators are the same, mine came with the tell tale 'Made in China' on the box. Which is why, if I knew then what I know now, I'd opt for what appears to be London stock of a 'Made in China' direct fit stator.

'Made in China' has come a long way. Who remembers the Jap Crap of the 1960's and early 70's?
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 12 September, 2019, 09:20:32 AM
I fitted a small volt meter just below the trip reset switches (photo attached) as I knew with the bikes mileage 20563 that there would be a good chance of a stator fail.
For quickness I took the + feed from a connection that I made on the side lights for extra LED lights, this will be slightly less than true battery voltage but still does the same job. The running the voltage settled at 13.6v so when it dropped to 21.1 v I knew I had a problem with charging.

Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: VanquishedWombat on 12 September, 2019, 11:44:04 AM
Great thanks for the pic and info. I'm thinking of putting in a dual-purpose voltmeter plus 2 x USB charger. Sadly I can't find one that shows cranking voltage. Another option is a plain USB charger point and a bluetooth battery meter linking to the iPhone which 'will' do the cranking check too, but its a tad more to spend.

Dual USB plus voltmeter
https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Waterproof-12v-Dual-USB-Car-Cigarette-Lighter-Socket-Plug-Charger-LED-Voltmeter/943847106

Bluetooth battery tester
https://www.amazon.co.uk/QUICKLYNKS-Bluetooth-Diagnostic-Analyzer-Measurement/dp/B07MY1B3DY

Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 12 September, 2019, 12:40:05 PM
Hi, I think that the blue tooth option would give a more accurate reading but it will not be as "in you face" notification that there is a charging problem when your out for a ride, which is the main reason that I would fit a volt meter.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: raYzerman on 12 September, 2019, 05:26:00 PM
Agree an always visible voltmeter is best.... here is one I fitted, wired direct to an always on circuit on my aux. fuse panel.. they aren't perfect, the voltage shows low by 0.3V and the ambient temperature display is off somewhat, but it does have it's own on/off switch on the back... leaving it on, bike off, will drain the battery down as the USB charger is on.
There are several voltmeter types you can get cheap, the trick is how to mount and is the display readable in daylight, and waterproof... perhaps get the blue display... seems better than red to me.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33059217841.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.35f24c6cw2QDAm&algo_pvid=62a2a1bf-aa67-4dba-9e3c-c61082b1da28&algo_expid=62a2a1bf-aa67-4dba-9e3c-c61082b1da28-25&btsid=6c92fa16-81c7-4790-883f-0c229ab3be19&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_10,searchweb201603_52
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Megalomaniac on 13 September, 2019, 10:40:10 AM
Looks like I have joined your club of electrical problems gents :( 56 reg A7 model
Yesterday at work trying to leave the office the bike flat out refused to start. After some push starting and help from a kind gent I  got it running in 2nd gear for less than a minute, when it died in gear while in motion (still in the underground parking lot). Needless to say, after that it was a no-hope situation.

I'll get my breakdown cover to tow it to a garage but I see there's already a lot of content/many threads on this topic so I wanted to summarise and maybe someone can highlight if I've missed anything, as I understand it I need:
1) A new flywheel
2) A new stator
3) Potentially a new rectifier?
4) An oil change

Any word on whether a new battery would be required?
I wanted to also ask about experiences in terms of total cost you experienced for these and whether you had a non-Honda dealer assist or a Honda network dealer only? I'm in the London area so I suspect I'll get fleeced for labour rates :(
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 13 September, 2019, 12:42:19 PM
Hi, It will probably be one of the following

1. Battery, but probably not as would have kept running with a push start.
2. Stator.
3> Regulator/Rectifier.

Just Copy the following into your browser and follow the testing procedure of the charging system.

https://bob.ollis-brown.co.uk/manuals/cbf1000/2006-2008-CBF1000-A-18%20BATTERY-CHARGING%20SYSTEM.pdf

Cheers and good luck
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 13 September, 2019, 02:00:55 PM
If the stator has failed you just need to replace that and nothing else. Some like to change the engine oil and filter too but if that's not due then I wouldn't bother, any oil contamination should have been taken care of by the oil filter. HOWEVER, as above, the Charging System needs to be properly tested before throwing your hard earned at it willy nilly fashion. If that testing proves the stator is faulty its a simple enough job requiring little more than a multimeter and the onboard tool kit.

Test the charging system by revving the engine to 2,500 RPM and checking the voltage across the battery terminals. If greater than 13.5v then rev the engine to 5,000 RPM and re-check the voltage across the battery terminals, if less than 14.8v then the charging system is OK. If the voltage across the battery terminals is less than 13.5v at 2,500 RPM or, more than 14.8v at 5,000 RPM then further testing of the Charging System components, terminals and connections is required. This is better explained by following the tests in Electrosportís generic fault finding flow chart for motorcycle charging systems.

The chart is not specific to CBF 1000ís or Honda but is easy enough to follow and all the testing can be carried out using a simple multimeter. It may help in following the chart to note the Honda CBF 1000 has a permanent magnetic alternator system with less than 4 different colour wires coming from the Regulator Rectifier. The Stator has three yellow wires to Regulator Rectifier which has a red positive output wire and a green negative output wire.

Electrosportís chart is free to download at https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1091/5694/files/fault-finding-diagram.pdf?235929069374954073

If you don't have a multimeter this one looks to have all the bells and whistles (20A, auto ranging, probes, croc clips, thermometer and a neat little storage bag all for £22.85 delivered https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VC99-Digital-Multimeter-Voltmeter-Thermometer-Resistance-AC-DC-Auto-Range-w-Bag/293074770579

Happy testings
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Megalomaniac on 13 September, 2019, 03:23:33 PM
Thanks both for your replies and the extra info, greatly appreciated!
I've opened up the link, which is really helpful in identifying the placement of what to test, and I've ordered one of the multimeters you ilnked me to - much better pricing than the ones I saw on Amazon, thanks!

As the bike won't start yet I'll have to check the voltages once the stator is replaced and the bike is running again, and then determine if any of the other components need replacing.

Many thanks again, I'll update once all is sorted
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: vinciebhoy on 26 September, 2019, 12:41:59 PM
Finally got my bike charging again!! after 2 Weeks and 2 Days and a cancelled trip to Ireland the correct part has finally arrived.
Regulator for a different bike sent instead of stator, sent it back but supplier didn't order stator until they received wrong part back, they then found that they didn't have a stator and had to order one in from there supplier  :232:
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: doctoras9 on 25 April, 2020, 08:14:58 AM
Hi guys,
I found this stator from aliexpress is extremely cheap,
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000382101401.html?spm=2114.search0302.3.155.363042d0Zqjsab&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_0,searchweb201603_0,ppcSwitch_0&algo_pvid=8aed4191-ac55-4e24-aa01-07d8d35a6a6e&algo_expid=8aed4191-ac55-4e24-aa01-07d8d35a6a6e-23 (https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000382101401.html?spm=2114.search0302.3.155.363042d0Zqjsab&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_0,searchweb201603_0,ppcSwitch_0&algo_pvid=8aed4191-ac55-4e24-aa01-07d8d35a6a6e&algo_expid=8aed4191-ac55-4e24-aa01-07d8d35a6a6e-23)
I don't know if quality is acceptable, I wouldn't bet, just in case you stay from stator on the trip to have a spare
Has anyone tried?
what is your opinion?
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 25 April, 2020, 09:12:45 AM
It seems wherever in Europe you buy a stator it comes with a 'Made in China' label so it may be an idea to source a locally stocked unbranded Made in China stator. With the choice of stators available there is no need to be fettling with connectors and wires either, check the stator you're ordering has the correct connector, length of harness and is ready to fit.

If your idea is to carry a spare stator just in case the stator fails that is a little excessive. Stators may appear to suddenly fail but the truth is they don't, its a gradual process. A better idea would be to regularly check the charging system and note the stators output then you can compare the results from test to test as time passes. If the stator is going to fail you'll know it before it does. I have test my ElectorSport 'Made in China' stator supplied by Busters (M&P) of Swansea in Wales at every service interval (4,000 miles) and it has been giving out a fairly healthy 14.2v at 5,000 RPM since I fitted it in June 2017.

Happy Days
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: doctoras9 on 25 April, 2020, 09:30:41 AM
I am the first owner, I have never had a problem with the stator or the electrical circuit, I have 60k km but limited use in recent years. Mine is without abs, maybe that's one reason I haven't had a problem so far.
Those of you who had problems with the stator and finally changed, have the intuition how that it responds, I do not have. However, I agree with your post that you should check beyond the voltmeter installed on it.
however, the price is tempting
you take it and forget it in a drawer and if necessary you install it
Thanks  :031:
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 25 April, 2020, 10:23:52 AM
Just don't forget which draw left it in  :087:
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: doctoras9 on 25 April, 2020, 12:22:01 PM
*Originally Posted by Art [+]
Just don't forget which draw left it in  :087:
:008: :008: it can happen
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: raYzerman on 25 April, 2020, 12:25:50 PM
I too bought a stator and regulator as a spare, after a friend's tale of being stranded while on vacation, had to tow to a Honda dealer and pay some very significant $$$ to replace them.  Stator had fried, and I had read that a design flaw (there was a recall)/insufficient oil cooling may be a factor.  Well known Canadian supplier for these things, I ordered the kit and yes, Made In China.  So, I expect there's a big stator plant in China somewhere.....
https://www.rmstator.com/en_ca/products/kit-rm01078-rms020-102340-rms900-106195

I recently bought a VFR800, also known for charging issues, but not so much stator issues.  It all starts with a meltdown of the connectors between the stator and the regulator... older tech regulator (not sure if the CBF has a mofset reg, but may) where excess current is shunted to ground.  What they do is upgrade to a Shindengen mofset regulator of much larger capacity and the same one is used on recent year Yamaha's (FJ09, FJR).  Methinks this just takes a bit  more load off the stator.  I'm intimately familiar with FJR's, and they have never had an issue.  So I installed a used FJ-09 regulator on the VFR along with modern connectors.

I believe the mofsets will allow a little higher charging voltage at perhaps a lower rpm as well, 5000 rpm voltage should peak out around 14.5V, but I find 2000 rpm voltage is very similar.  On a CBF, I think as a general practice, if you're keeping the revs up around 3500 plus, there is better oil circulation on the stator to help dissipate heat.  Perhaps once a year, check your stator/reg connections to ensure they are clean... even sparingly lube with a carbon based contact paste, careful not to use excess so there is no cross-flow of electrons to an adjacent terminal.. only takes a wee bit (Ox-Gard or Noalox).  I wouldn't advise dielectric grease in this case, you want contact not insolation.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Art on 25 April, 2020, 01:01:45 PM
What is wrong with testing and noting the charging system output at the 4,000 mile service intervals?

Yes, the CBF has a MOSFET rectifier
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: raYzerman on 25 April, 2020, 01:24:33 PM
Perfectly good advice, Art.  Nothing wrong with that at all.
Thanks for the clarification on having a mofset, I feel better now.
Title: Re: Stator Suppliers
Post by: Piper on 25 April, 2020, 02:13:05 PM
If any one is wanting a UK manufactured stator I bought mine here.
https://www.electrexworld.co.uk/cgi-bin/sh000001.pl?WD=cbf1000&PN=G112%2ehtml#SID=200.
and
https://www.electrexworld.co.uk/acatalog/About_Us.html
Fitted it a few years ago with no problems. (Not saying they are any better than the Chinese ones as I have not been able to compare). Unfortunately they are closed at the moment due to Covid 19 but the site does have a lot of technical information.
Pete