Author Topic: Why a Power commander requires additional mapping on a test bench  (Read 714 times)

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Offline MohKraats

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Hello Biffers

Many bikers talk about upgrading their bike,
mostly in the hope to increase the power of their bike ....

The Power commander is then a widely mentioned option.
And many bikers save up the money to buy one.
Not realizing that that is only half the costs.
After buying and installing the Power Commander,
one has to have it mapped at a test bench.
That is not cheap.
Easily going for 300 Euro and more, depending bike and state of the bike.

And why ??

Like sheep look all the same, still one sheep is not the other sheep.
Same for bike engines.
Compression is not exactly the same for all cylinders, even within one engine. Valves do not open all exactly as far.
etc etc. Engines do have tollerances. they are quite the same, but not exactly the same.
At the production plant they have measured many engines and taken average values that will work on almost every engine.
Those values go into the map that is programmed in your ECM.
However, especially when your engine is supposed to run quite lean (because of catalist),
Such map is only best effort, but never spot on.

The same goes for the map that can be downloaded for the Power Commander for a CBF1000F.
That matches one unique bike, but will be different on an other bike.

And how great the differences are ??
Well, check out the attached pdf file.
It shows the map from the power commander on my bike.
In the left column the rpm, in the top row the percentage throttle opening.
Each field the deviation in percentage with respect to the value in the preprogrammed map in the ECM.
It deviates from -2% to +13% in my case

and again:
This is only as example, this mapping will not be a close fit for your bike !!!!

This is why to have it mapped on a test bench.
This is what results in smooth running.

And yes, this also what makes a Power Commander a very expensive solution too.

This is also why a power box is such a poor solution
A power box only increases fuel in general, over the whole map.

Greez,
Moh
Last Edit: 15 May, 2021, 03:05:02 PM by MohKraats

#1

Offline Motopete

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I have to agree with you.
My cbf came with a PCV already installed.
The installed map is way different than the one you posted.
So I highly doubt the installed map was done on a dyno.
I'm trying to decide if I want to go to the expense of having it tuned or just leave it, it does seem to run pretty good.

#2

Offline MohKraats

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Hello Motopete,

Well, that is exactly the thing I wanted to say.
The mapping WILL look fifferent from bike to bike.

But anyway,
You could just let it have a go on a bench to doublecheck.
Mind you, changing exhaust or e.g. the airfilter for a different type will change your mapping.

There should be some default map for the CBF downloadable form the internet.
Uou can download that one and compare it with what you have in youre bike.
If it is the same, you know what youre at.

A cheap and easy way to experience the difference  that your map makes to stock engine mapping.
Your PCV does have a second map.
Hook up a switch to the input of the PCV and adjust the config accordingly (could be correct by default).
Leave the second map empty (all zero's)
Now you can swap between stock and mapped just with the flick of a switch.


Havd fun

Greez,
Moh

#3

Offline Motopete

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I like the switch idea.

The PCV is so much different than the PC3 I had on my FZ6 as it came with some canned tunes.

I can not find any base/default maps online, and I have looked.

Moh what mods have been done to your bike, How far from the base is the map you posted?

Do you (or anybody) have a link or a map that I could double check.
I hate to think that the previous owner tuned with no Idea of what he was doing (but it wouldn't surprise me).

#4

Offline MohKraats

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Hello Motopete,

I found maps on the Dynojet site.
They refer to it as "tunes"
Though just had a quick look and I found only the CBF MK1 there.....

But anyway,
Don't expect great differences.
Actualy,
When driving a decent fuel (so no E10 crap) you might not even notice a difference.
You won't gain power on this bike.
The best way to see any result, is to measure the actual O2 level in the exhaust gasses.
And you might see it from the coloration of the sparkplugs.
The sparkplugs turn very light, up till greyish white when running too lean.
When running good, they should have a nice light brownish color.

But yeah, here the PCV is for the health of the bike more tgen for the personal experience.

Greez,
Moh

#5

Offline MohKraats

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Say Motopete,

Thinking about it,
Vaguely I remember the PCV already having a kind of a pre-set mapping when it come out of the box.

So, might be yours still has the factory map.....

Greez,
Moh
Last Edit: 24 May, 2021, 10:37:27 AM by MohKraats

#6

Offline Motopete

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Yes Moh,

That is the map that is installed, the default map the PCV came with.

It is super lean compared to yours.

Are you using the Dynojet o2 optimizer?

I believe the it came with the unit.

I checked and I have one installed, that might explain my poor fuel economy lol.
Last Edit: 25 May, 2021, 04:27:51 AM by Motopete

#7

Offline MohKraats

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Hello Motopete,

I am not familiar with an optimizer.

They do sell a sort of autotune device for the PCV.
Wich that device, the PCV constantly adjusts its map based on measurement info from the autotune device.

Anyway, when the bike is running lean, youre mileage should be good.
If your bike takes more fuel then expected, most common cause is your right hand.
Driving style makes all the difference on mileage.
Next to that, there might be sometging wrong, or the bike suffers fauling somehow somewhere.
E.g. fauled injectors also influence mileage.
This because when fauled, they are not capable of spraying the fuel out in as thin drops as possible.
And yes
E10 also causes injector fauling.

But said that, also your type if trip does do a lot on mileage.
I commute through a dense area with regular trafic jams and a lot of traffic lights.
That doesn't do good on my mileage at all.
Long strech highway, even when doing 130 km/h constantly gives me way better mileage.

Greez,
Moh

#8

Offline Motopete

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The "Dynojet Optimizer" plugs into the harness instead of the O2 plug so there is no fault code.
It tells the ecu that it is runing too lean and tricks it into sending more fuel.
I was comparing my map to your map, that how I got the idea that its lean.
Yes my right wrist gets pretty happy at times.
But you are right I need to check the spark plugs that will be the tell tale.

#9

Offline MohKraats

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Hello MotoPete,

First thing I would do, is check if you still have the original O2 sensor fitted
If so, is take out the Optimizer.
It doesn't make sense to have an optimizer with the CBF and the stock sensor.

To understand why, I think I have to explain some things here

A/F mixture and the catalist and engine power
As you know, one does need to mix air and fuel to make it burn.
From the air, the fuel uses the Oxygen to burn.
In an ideal situation, the Air/Fuel mixture ratio (A/F ratio) is such that both are completely used in a burn (combustion).
This ideal A/F is around 12,5:1
At this A/F, one has the maximum power one can achieve with a combustion engine.

So why all the talk about Lambda 1.00 and/or A/F 14,7:1 ??
Well, for environmental reasons, nowadays we use catalists in our engine to reduce the CO gasses in out exhaust.
The catalist combines CO gasses to O2 gasses (oxygen), resulting in CO2.
To do so, as you understand, one does have some Oxygen left after the combustion, for the catalist to use.
That is why we run engines lean.
At a A/F of 14,7:1  there is exactly the right level of oxygen left in the exhaust for the optimal function of the catalist.

The CBF
Where on most cars, and some older motorbikes and on modern motorbikes,
One does use an O2 sensor to measure how much O2 (Oxygen) is present in the exhaust, and adjust the injected fuel quantity accordingly, to keep the amount optimal.
The CBF DOES NOT.
It runs by fixed mapping.
That is, it DOES NOT ADJUST the amount of fuel injected. It only follows the preprogrammed map for that.
To get the optimal amount of Oxygen in the exhaust one has applied another trick.
One injects air into the exhaust. (secondairy air)
The ECM does use the O2 sensor to adjust the amount of air.
The CBF does run lean by default, and the Oxygen is fine tuned by the secondairy air.

So, to improve the situation,
One can use a PCV.
The PCV is hooked up between the ECM and the Injectors.
It will measure the injection time as the ECM uses to control the injectors,
then alter that time plus or minus, based on its own mapping and use that result to control the injectors.
So,
still no use of the O2 sensor.
To make the mapping, you need to measure the exhaust gasses under all the different conditions in the map, and adjust the ma values to get the desired A/F
In my case I had the bike adjusted to an A/F of 13:1
On a previous bike (BMW) I also had good results with an A/F of 14,2:1 already. Just for driveability improvement.

What the Optimizer is supposed to do, if I understand correctly,
is adjust the O2 sensor signal to generate a signal for a different A/F level.
With a CBF stock O2 sensor, this is not possible !!!
To do that, you have to have a linear sensor.
That is also what is supplied with the auto tune box.
If one would just use the stock sensor to adjust the mapping, one would keep the A/F at 14,7:1, what doesn't make sense for the CBF, because of the secondairy air available.

In my case, I have just left the stock sensor in there end left it connected too.
No issue.
In case you do not want to have a sensor in there, one can use a sensor dummy to fool the ECM and prevent DTC's from popping up.

Greez,
Moh


 


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