Author Topic: Cold bike takes long crancking  (Read 2367 times)

Scootyman, iNCORRIGIBLE, MohKraats, Art and 14 Guests are viewing this topic.

#30

Online MohKraats

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #30 on: 30 April, 2021, 06:39:50 PM
Hello Davidjg,

Two reasons I am on this.
First of all, this is my first bike that takes so long to crank.
And yeah, I have done my mileage too.
On bike probably 60 or 70 k kms.
Second of all, there is a weird difference in cranking time between cold bike and warm bike, that wasn't there in the beginning.

Besides that, I do see a significant
Difference in injector timing between the two situations.
So, something is not right here.

Hence the question: do you experience difference in cranking time between first and second start ??

Or anybody else for that matter??

Greez,
Moh
Last Edit: 30 April, 2021, 06:40:23 PM by MohKraats

#31

Offline davidjg

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #31 on: 30 April, 2021, 07:09:42 PM
Hi. Have just gone through your posts again. You do not say how long it takes to start from cold - is the cranking time in seconds  (e.g. 5 to 6 seconds) or minutes. We have had another fairly cold winter, wonder whether the cold starting will improve as the temperature rises, why don't you wait and find out  -if it does maybe you are using the wrong  engine oil for winter use.

#32

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #32 on: 01 May, 2021, 10:06:37 AM
Hello Davidjg,

There is no relation with weather.
Cold bike refers to cold engine.
Say after engine was off for couple of hours.

Greez,
Moh

#33

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #33 on: 01 May, 2021, 10:18:43 AM
Hello Biffers,

I have made sound recordings of the strating of my bike.
A poor one with cold engine.
And a second one, straight after that. (With engine still cold).

Records can be found here :
https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=VZsxw1XZIRdih3cLtHfzlJnn2erxnysnfAkk

Greez,
Moh

#34

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #34 on: 01 May, 2021, 03:20:57 PM
Additional info.

I did make some measurements on the injection time at start up to give an idea.

At a proper start, injection time starts at 6ms, which drops down immediately after that to normal 2.6ms idling injection time.

At a poor start, injection time start at 2.6ms as it keeps during idling.

#35

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #35 on: 03 May, 2021, 08:47:11 AM
Update.

Have been to a big Honda dealership.
They don't have a clue what I am talking about.
However,
Talking to their technical "expert", it became clear to me that outside the regular problems they don't have any experience and/or knowlegde.
Without DTC, they are lost.

Sounds like the Toyota problem.
When Toyota's became quite problem free, the mechanics didn't have experience in repairing no more, so in case of a real problem they have a hard time solving it.

Don't know if this should make me happy or sad......

Greez,
Moh

#36

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #36 on: 03 May, 2021, 03:33:33 PM
In an earlier life it took me 5 years to complete a Motor Vehicle Apprenticeship, add to that another 2 years to complete a Motor Vehicle Technicians Apprenticeship. We also had one or two weeks per year of hands on training  to update us on the new developments etc. Here we are nigh on half a century of research and development later and it now takes just a fraction of that time to get a framed certified qualification hanging on the wall. Is it any wonder the garages and workshops are now manned by head scratching fitters who's only hope is that the problem will fix itself.

#37

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #37 on: 03 May, 2021, 07:03:29 PM
*Originally Posted by MohKraats [+]
Update.

Have been to a big Honda dealership.
They don't have a clue what I am talking about.
However,
Talking to their technical "expert", it became clear to me that outside the regular problems they don't have any experience and/or knowlegde.
Without DTC, they are lost.

Sounds like the Toyota problem.
When Toyota's became quite problem free, the mechanics didn't have experience in repairing no more, so in case of a real problem they have a hard time solving it.

Don't know if this should make me happy or sad......

Greez,
Moh

But is there a problem here? Your bike starts right? When I hooked mine up to my two channel oscilloscope, I couldnít see any problem and a very similar pattern to what you are experiencing. I hadnít started my bike in weeks and yes, it had condensation in the bores Iím guessing because a strip out and clean of the plugs with an airline down each port sorted it out and it started after a second or two cranking. From then on it always starts. It may take a second or two but it ....starts! I donít see what you are trying to diagnose here. There isnít a fault and therefore there isnít a DTC being flagged up.
Thereís nothing more to add here surely?

#38

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #38 on: 03 May, 2021, 07:12:19 PM
*Originally Posted by Scootyman [+]
But is there a problem here? Your bike starts right? When I hooked mine up to my two channel oscilloscope, I couldnít see any problem and a very similar pattern to what you are experiencing. I hadnít started my bike in weeks and yes, it had condensation in the bores Iím guessing because a strip out and clean of the plugs with an airline down each port sorted it out and it started after a second or two cranking. From then on it always starts. It may take a second or two but it ....starts! I donít see what you are trying to diagnose here. There isnít a fault and therefore there isnít a DTC being flagged up.
Thereís nothing more to add here surely?

Hello Scootyman,

Maybe, when you are still at it,
Can you see a longer first injection when starting the bike ??
And secondly, if you kill the bike directly after a cold start and start it again, does it take just as long crancking as first time ??
Moreover, if on a cold bike you give the startbutton a very short pulse (as short as you manage) and then start the bike, does it takes just as long crancking as always, or does it start quicker ?? (as in my case)

Where for cold bike, I mean after havig been standing for a couple of hours.

Greez,
Moh

#39

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Re: Cold bike takes long crancking
Reply #39 on: 03 May, 2021, 07:15:39 PM
Ah, and yes,

As many more might ask:
What is all this fuzz about, since the bike does always start eventually.

Well,
The way a bike starts, is a good indication about the health of a bike. (or state of maintenance)
So, thats why I always pay much attention to that.
And, it struck me that something is not as it should be on my bike.

Hence all this fuzz,

Greez,
Moh